Weaponry of Pesmerge!

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Weaponry of Pesmerge!; What kind of weapons do Pesmerge need?
Topic Started: 22nd December 2013 - 09:51 PM (21,650 Views)
FulcrumKAF	23rd December 2013 - 07:25 AM Post #26
Po210 Posts: 2,931 Group: Admins Member #2 Joined: Nov 17, 2012 Mood None	Gundî Uçar 23rd December 2013 - 07:06 AM FulcrumKAF 23rd December 2013 - 07:02 AM Quoting limited to 2 levels deepEDIT: Fulkrum, wouldn't it be possible to make weapon deals with China and Russia through Iran and maybe even Syria when it's stabil? Now, not officially though. I know that we could do it anytime if we were to be independent. If our relations with the 2 are good, then yes, that would be possible (would be a costly and politically difficult transfer. First Iran has to buy them, and then we must officially buy them from Iran. Not to mention all the political complications that would fallow such an purchase). However, i doubt any of the two would willingly allow Kurdistan to have any weapons that could threaten them or their interests. Russia and China are not like the west. If you have the money, they can trust you/it is no threat to their interest, and it is possible to smuggle the weapons without anyone tracing the weapons back to them; then they could sell the weapons directly to KRG. This will be possible with Small arms and "medium" (as some like to call them) weapons. This is not possible with larger SAMs, aircraft, tanks, IFVs, ACVs, RSS, SPAAG etc You should also note that KRG is allowed by law to buy weapons for interior security (in other words; Police level weapons and small arms). Those weapons we can buy pretty much like any other state.
	The army is the true nobility of a nation Never plan on the thoughts of others, but on their capabilities One indivisible and sovereign Kurdish nation for all Kurds! Chase all al nusra and Daash terrorists out of Kurdistan!! Her biji YPG u Peshmerga!


Ali Alqosh	23rd December 2013 - 07:48 AM Post #27
Posts: 2,197 Group: Elite Member #250 Joined: Sep 22, 2013 Mood None	FulcrumKAF 23rd December 2013 - 07:25 AM Gundî Uçar 23rd December 2013 - 07:06 AM Quoting limited to 2 levels deepEDIT: Fulkrum, wouldn't it be possible to make weapon deals with China and Russia through Iran and maybe even Syria when it's stabil? If our relations with the 2 are good, then yes, that would be possible (would be a costly and politically difficult transfer. First Iran has to buy them, and then we must officially buy them from Iran. Not to mention all the political complications that would fallow such an purchase). However, i doubt any of the two would willingly allow Kurdistan to have any weapons that could threaten them or their interests. Russia and China are not like the west. If you have the money, they can trust you/it is no threat to their interest, and it is possible to smuggle the weapons without anyone tracing the weapons back to them; then they could sell the weapons directly to KRG. This will be possible with Small arms and "medium" (as some like to call them) weapons. This is not possible with larger SAMs, aircraft, tanks, IFVs, ACVs, RSS, SPAAG etc You should also note that KRG is allowed by law to buy weapons for interior security (in other words; Police level weapons and small arms). Those weapons we can buy pretty much like any other state. Keko, first you say that they wont sell weapons that could threaten their interests and then you say that if we have the money they can trust us, could you elaborate?



FulcrumKAF	23rd December 2013 - 07:57 AM Post #28
Po210 Posts: 2,931 Group: Admins Member #2 Joined: Nov 17, 2012 Mood None	Gundî Uçar 23rd December 2013 - 07:48 AM FulcrumKAF 23rd December 2013 - 07:25 AM Quoting limited to 2 levels deepEDIT: Fulkrum, wouldn't it be possible to make weapon deals with China and Russia through Iran and maybe even Syria when it's stabil? Keko, first you say that they wont sell weapons that could threaten their interests and then you say that if we have the money they can trust us, could you elaborate? I said Iran and Syria wont sell us weapons (from Russia/China) if it threatens their interest. Russia and China will sell us weapons directly if we; Have the money, are to be trusted, do not threaten their interest either and can smuggle the weapons without any "fingerprints" from Russia/China (we need to qualify in all the mentioned points). The first part of the text is meant primarily on Iran/Syria; If our relations with the 2 (Iran/Syria) are good, then yes, that would be possible (would be a costly and politically difficult transfer. First Iran/Syria have to buy them, and then we must officially buy them from Iran. Not to mention all the political complications that would fallow such an purchase). However, i doubt any of the two (Iran and Syria) would willingly allow Kurdistan to have any weapons that could threaten them or their interests.
	The army is the true nobility of a nation Never plan on the thoughts of others, but on their capabilities One indivisible and sovereign Kurdish nation for all Kurds! Chase all al nusra and Daash terrorists out of Kurdistan!! Her biji YPG u Peshmerga!


Ali Alqosh	23rd December 2013 - 08:03 AM Post #29
Posts: 2,197 Group: Elite Member #250 Joined: Sep 22, 2013 Mood None	FulcrumKAF 23rd December 2013 - 07:57 AM Gundî Uçar 23rd December 2013 - 07:48 AM Quoting limited to 2 levels deepEDIT: Fulkrum, wouldn't it be possible to make weapon deals with China and Russia through Iran and maybe even Syria when it's stabil? I said Iran and Syria wont sell us weapons (from Russia/China) if it threatens their interest. Russia and China will sell us weapons directly if we; Have the money, are to be trusted, do not threaten their interest either and can smuggle the weapons without any "fingerprints" from Russia/China (we need to qualify in all the mentioned points). The first part of the text is meant primarily on Iran/Syria; If our relations with the 2 (Iran/Syria) are good, then yes, that would be possible (would be a costly and politically difficult transfer. First Iran/Syria have to buy them, and then we must officially buy them from Iran. Not to mention all the political complications that would fallow such an purchase). However, i doubt any of the two (Iran and Syria) would willingly allow Kurdistan to have any weapons that could threaten them or their interests. Ohh my bad then!



Ali Alqosh	23rd December 2013 - 08:30 AM Post #30
Posts: 2,197 Group: Elite Member #250 Joined: Sep 22, 2013 Mood None	Anyone, feel fre to post how you think we should build up our defence and attack systems!



Jim M	22nd December 2014 - 08:28 PM Post #31
R. Sergeant Major Posts: 751 Group: Elite Member #536 Joined: Sep 26, 2014 Mood None	If I was the leader of the KRG I would turn to the best friend the Kurds have in the region, Israel. The state of Israel has learned some very important lessons from wars that it has fought in the past and Kurdistan if it was ever to have aspirations of becoming a state it would be wise to learn from them. One of the most important lessons would be to not depend on anyone else for your security. Israel scrambled to find weapons all over Europe after it won nationhood at the UN and the first war it fought with its Arab neighbors was a close thing. Ever since then Israel has striven to have the best weapons money could buy and even went deeply in debt to achieve this. Israel learned to its dismay that it could not even depend on its friends when it was in dire need causing another crisis in a subsequent war. For this reason Israel started its own weapons industry almost from scratch. It wasn't easy but today their arms industry is world class and self supporting. One other important thing that Israel had after the second world war was veterans who trained the next generation of fighters and were instrumental in giving them the advantage of training. Today they have the best trained soldiers in the region and all these things makes their moral high enough to have the confidence to know they are unbeatable. All this from a little country both geographically and with a population of about 8 million. The Kurds on the other hand have no country except the semi autonomy of the KRG. It may never become more than this because of political pressure in the region. This however shouldn't stop the KRG from building up an arms stockpile. Just because your neighbors don't want you to be armed is no guarantee they will not attack you anyway. It only means that when they become aggressive they don't have to worry about you fighting back. Being unarmed only encourages aggression being armed deters it. There is no advantage to playing the victim and your friend the United States may not always be there or may come to your aid too late. As they did after Saddam killed tens of thousands with his poison gas attack. The border of Iraq did not stop Turkey either when they chased the PKK into Iraq and continued to attack them there. I don't think Turkey makes any distinction between Kurds of any nationality and considers you all troublemakers. This is going to be especially true since the KRG has achieved semi-independence and the Kurds of Turkey and Iran are going to want the same. My contention is this that if you want an independent state you must have weapons. Without weapons you will continue to be assimilated into the separate countries you inhabit and eventually cease to exist. Assimilation has stopped temporarily in Iraq as the country is divided by war but when Baghdad gets the upper hand again it will continue. I don't understand why Baghdad doesn't want the KRG to have the same weapons that it has as theoretically the KRG is part of Iraq and should be armed equally if for no other reason than to defend itself from outside aggression. This reluctance to arm the Kurds can have no other consequence than to keep the Kurds weak so that Baghdad can bully them. If I was a Kurd I would be outraged at this behavior and do whatever it took to become armed. I guess the bottom line is the only thing stopping the KRG from becoming armed is the will to do it. Edited by Jim M, 2nd January 2015 - 09:51 AM.
	Kurdish Wisdom of War Proverbs: "Deal with your friends as if they will become your enemies tomorrow, and deal with your enemies as if they will become your friends tomorrow." "Those away from the battlefield boast about their swords." "Those who do not go to war roar like a lion." "Everything is pardoned the brave." "Whoever digs a pit for his enemy should dig it his own size." "A thousand friends are too few; one enemy is one too many."


ALAN	1st January 2015 - 01:46 AM Post #32
Posts: 34,677 Group: Admins Member #1 Joined: Nov 16, 2012 Mood None	The title of this topic is not correct what should we rename it to?
	Russian Girenak Joseph, who visited Kirkuk in Kurdistan as a part of his tour throu the 1870 - 1873 AD, who published the results of his trip & his studies later in 1879, in the 4th volume in the Bulletin of the Caucasus department of the Royal Geographical Russian Society estimated Kirkuk's population as many as 12-50,000 people, & he emphasized that except 40 Christian families, the rest of the population were Kurds. As for The Turkmen & Arabs, they have not been already existed at the time.


Brendar	2nd January 2015 - 10:42 AM Post #33
Posts: 3,190 Group: Elite Member #6 Joined: Nov 20, 2012 Mood None	Jim Maguire 22nd December 2014 - 08:28 PM If I was the leader of the KRG I would turn to the best friend the Kurds have in the region, Israel. The state of Israel has learned some very important lessons from wars that it has fought in the past and Kurdistan if it was ever to have aspirations of becoming a state it would be wise to learn from them. One of the most important lessons would be to not depend on anyone else for your security. Israel scrambled to find weapons all over Europe after it won nationhood at the UN and the first war it fought with its Arab neighbors was a close thing. Ever since then Israel has striven to have the best weapons money could buy and even went deeply in debt to achieve this. Israel learned to its dismay that it could not even depend on its friends when it was in dire need causing another crisis in a subsequent war. For this reason Israel started its own weapons industry almost from scratch. It wasn't easy but today their arms industry is world class and self supporting. One other important thing that Israel had after the second world war was veterans who trained the next generation of fighters and were instrumental in giving them the advantage of training. Today they have the best trained soldiers in the region and all these things makes their moral high enough to have the confidence to know they are unbeatable. All this from a little country both geographically and with a population of about 8 million. The Kurds on the other hand have no country except the semi autonomy of the KRG. It may never become more than this because of political pressure in the region. This however shouldn't stop the KRG from building up an arms stockpile. Just because your neighbors don't want you to be armed is no guarantee they will not attack you anyway. It only means that when they become aggressive they don't have to worry about you fighting back. Being unarmed only encourages aggression being armed deters it. There is no advantage to playing the victim and your friend the United States may not always be there or may come to your aid too late. As they did after Saddam killed tens of thousands with his poison gas attack. The border of Iraq did not stop Turkey either when they chased the PKK into Iraq and continued to attack them there. I don't think Turkey makes any distinction between Kurds of any nationality and considers you all troublemakers. This is going to be especially true since the KRG has achieved semi-independence and the Kurds of Turkey and Iran are going to want the same. My contention is this that if you want an independent state you must have weapons. Without weapons you will continue to be assimilated into the separate countries you inhabit and eventually cease to exist. Assimilation has stopped temporarily in Iraq as the country is divided by war but when Baghdad gets the upper hand again it will continue. I don't understand why Baghdad doesn't want the KRG to have the same weapons that it has as theoretically the KRG is part of Iraq and should be armed equally if for no other reason than to defend itself from outside aggression. This reluctance to arm the Kurds can have no other consequence than to keep the Kurds weak so that Baghdad can bully them. If I was a Kurd I would be outraged at this behavior and do whatever it took to become armed. I guess the bottom line is the only thing stopping the KRG from becoming armed is the will to do it. I agree with you. The state of Israel has helped Kurds alot and we will remain as a Kurdish faithful nation grateful to them. Israel was the first country to announce its support of an independent Kurdistan. For years Israel's relationship with the Kurds was kept secret, but gradually the issue has cropped up more and more in interviews in Israeli media and in academic reports. Mossad has intensified its presence in Kurdistan in the recent years, they have been supporting the Kurdish armed forces since 1960's and to this very day. Kurdish leaders and officials must see Israel as a role model for an independent Kurdistan. I think Israel sees the Kurds as trusted allies in a volatile region. Muslims in general think it is a crime to establish ties with Israel, as a Kurd I think it is a blessing. Currently, Israel is one country against many. But with an independent Kurdish state, Israel will have a genuine friend in the region for the first time. Jim Maguire did you know that Yitzhak Mordechai former israel's defence minister was born in Kurdistan and made aliyah to Israel in 1949.



RawandKurdistani	2nd January 2015 - 10:59 AM Post #34
Surchi/Xoshnawi Posts: 4,646 Group: Senior Members Member #3 Joined: Nov 17, 2012 Mood None	Brendar 2nd January 2015 - 10:42 AM Jim Maguire 22nd December 2014 - 08:28 PM If I was the leader of the KRG I would turn to the best friend the Kurds have in the region, Israel. The state of Israel has learned some very important lessons from wars that it has fought in the past and Kurdistan if it was ever to have aspirations of becoming a state it would be wise to learn from them. One of the most important lessons would be to not depend on anyone else for your security. Israel scrambled to find weapons all over Europe after it won nationhood at the UN and the first war it fought with its Arab neighbors was a close thing. Ever since then Israel has striven to have the best weapons money could buy and even went deeply in debt to achieve this. Israel learned to its dismay that it could not even depend on its friends when it was in dire need causing another crisis in a subsequent war. For this reason Israel started its own weapons industry almost from scratch. It wasn't easy but today their arms industry is world class and self supporting. One other important thing that Israel had after the second world war was veterans who trained the next generation of fighters and were instrumental in giving them the advantage of training. Today they have the best trained soldiers in the region and all these things makes their moral high enough to have the confidence to know they are unbeatable. All this from a little country both geographically and with a population of about 8 million. The Kurds on the other hand have no country except the semi autonomy of the KRG. It may never become more than this because of political pressure in the region. This however shouldn't stop the KRG from building up an arms stockpile. Just because your neighbors don't want you to be armed is no guarantee they will not attack you anyway. It only means that when they become aggressive they don't have to worry about you fighting back. Being unarmed only encourages aggression being armed deters it. There is no advantage to playing the victim and your friend the United States may not always be there or may come to your aid too late. As they did after Saddam killed tens of thousands with his poison gas attack. The border of Iraq did not stop Turkey either when they chased the PKK into Iraq and continued to attack them there. I don't think Turkey makes any distinction between Kurds of any nationality and considers you all troublemakers. This is going to be especially true since the KRG has achieved semi-independence and the Kurds of Turkey and Iran are going to want the same. My contention is this that if you want an independent state you must have weapons. Without weapons you will continue to be assimilated into the separate countries you inhabit and eventually cease to exist. Assimilation has stopped temporarily in Iraq as the country is divided by war but when Baghdad gets the upper hand again it will continue. I don't understand why Baghdad doesn't want the KRG to have the same weapons that it has as theoretically the KRG is part of Iraq and should be armed equally if for no other reason than to defend itself from outside aggression. This reluctance to arm the Kurds can have no other consequence than to keep the Kurds weak so that Baghdad can bully them. If I was a Kurd I would be outraged at this behavior and do whatever it took to become armed. I guess the bottom line is the only thing stopping the KRG from becoming armed is the will to do it. I agree with you. The state of Israel has helped Kurds alot and we will remain as a Kurdish faithful nation grateful to them. Israel was the first country to announce its support of an independent Kurdistan. For years Israel's relationship with the Kurds was kept secret, but gradually the issue has cropped up more and more in interviews in Israeli media and in academic reports. Mossad has intensified its presence in Kurdistan in the recent years, they have been supporting the Kurdish armed forces since 1960's and to this very day. Kurdish leaders and officials must see Israel as a role model for an independent Kurdistan. I think Israel sees the Kurds as trusted allies in a volatile region. Muslims in general think it is a crime to establish ties with Israel, as a Kurd I think it is a blessing. Currently, Israel is one country against many. But with an independent Kurdish state, Israel will have a genuine friend in the region for the first time. Jim Maguire did you know that Yitzhak Mordechai former israel's defence minister was born in Kurdistan and made aliyah to Israel in 1949. Come on mate, I've never said establishing ties with Israel is a crime, I've said It's immoral, as there's no difference between Israeli authorities and the Turkish authorities for instance, one holds a piece of our homeland, the other doesn't, that's about the only major difference there. If you wanna cooperate with Israel, you might as well get some closer ties with Turkey, that's how I see It. I simply don't want Kurdistan to be the dog of other powers, especially not powers with dirty hands (Note this does not include every single Citizen, It's simply a reference to the authorities of the country) And before I get accused of antisemitism (of course) I would like to point out that Israel Is NOT a Jewish state at all, they're a bunch of atheistic Europeans that decided to settle in the Middle East and pulled a few actual practicing Jews with them, to strengthen their claim of being Jews perhaps, actual Jews I respect as fellow faithful men and women, but god damn me If this state of Israel is Jewish. Edited by RawandKurdistani, 2nd January 2015 - 11:08 AM.
	I am confused by God's wisdom: In this world of States Why have the Kurds remained Stateless, dispossessed, What for have they all become fugitives, condemned? Ahmad Khani Feed the hungry and visit a sick person And free the captive If he be unjustly confined Assist any person oppressed Whether Muslim or non-Muslim - Prophet Muhammad Ibn Abdullah (PBUH)


FulcrumKAF	2nd January 2015 - 11:42 AM Post #35
Po210 Posts: 2,931 Group: Admins Member #2 Joined: Nov 17, 2012 Mood None	ALAN 1st January 2015 - 01:46 AM The title of this topic is not correct what should we rename it to? Cay xaney Peshmerga or Peshmerga discussion or something. This page has become a place in which we discuss what Peshmerga should do in the future more or less.
	The army is the true nobility of a nation Never plan on the thoughts of others, but on their capabilities One indivisible and sovereign Kurdish nation for all Kurds! Chase all al nusra and Daash terrorists out of Kurdistan!! Her biji YPG u Peshmerga!


Jim M	2nd January 2015 - 04:29 PM Post #36
R. Sergeant Major Posts: 751 Group: Elite Member #536 Joined: Sep 26, 2014 Mood None	RawandKurdistani 2nd January 2015 - 10:59 AM Brendar 2nd January 2015 - 10:42 AM Quoting limited to 2 levels deep Come on mate, I've never said establishing ties with Israel is a crime, I've said It's immoral, as there's no difference between Israeli authorities and the Turkish authorities for instance, one holds a piece of our homeland, the other doesn't, that's about the only major difference there. If you wanna cooperate with Israel, you might as well get some closer ties with Turkey, that's how I see It. I simply don't want Kurdistan to be the dog of other powers, especially not powers with dirty hands (Note this does not include every single Citizen, It's simply a reference to the authorities of the country) And before I get accused of antisemitism (of course) I would like to point out that Israel Is NOT a Jewish state at all, they're a bunch of atheistic Europeans that decided to settle in the Middle East and pulled a few actual practicing Jews with them, to strengthen their claim of being Jews perhaps, actual Jews I respect as fellow faithful men and women, but god damn me If this state of Israel is Jewish. Israel immoral.!! That sounds interesting coming from a man who would ban alcohol and turn women's bodies into state property. I'm sure the rest of the forum would be very interested in a much deeper discussion on how you feel about all that. How about it RawandKurdistani tell us how you really feel?
	Kurdish Wisdom of War Proverbs: "Deal with your friends as if they will become your enemies tomorrow, and deal with your enemies as if they will become your friends tomorrow." "Those away from the battlefield boast about their swords." "Those who do not go to war roar like a lion." "Everything is pardoned the brave." "Whoever digs a pit for his enemy should dig it his own size." "A thousand friends are too few; one enemy is one too many."


RawandKurdistani	2nd January 2015 - 08:41 PM Post #37
Surchi/Xoshnawi Posts: 4,646 Group: Senior Members Member #3 Joined: Nov 17, 2012 Mood None	Jim Maguire 2nd January 2015 - 04:29 PM RawandKurdistani 2nd January 2015 - 10:59 AM Quoting limited to 2 levels deep Israel immoral.!! That sounds interesting coming from a man who would ban alcohol and turn women's bodies into state property. I'm sure the rest of the forum would be very interested in a much deeper discussion on how you feel about all that. How about it RawandKurdistani tell us how you really feel? Come on man, banning alcohol would be a salvation for the world, not a difference between banning alcohol and banning strong narcotics, sure It's tough for some addicts, but they'll get a better life once this poison is out of their lives. And of course I won't stand for murder, what kind of sick world Is It we're living in today? It's as If everything bad Is the norm these days. I do not need to question my position on any of these things, I know I'm right and none can deny that. My friend Jim, what more do you want to know? Edited by RawandKurdistani, 2nd January 2015 - 08:46 PM.
	I am confused by God's wisdom: In this world of States Why have the Kurds remained Stateless, dispossessed, What for have they all become fugitives, condemned? Ahmad Khani Feed the hungry and visit a sick person And free the captive If he be unjustly confined Assist any person oppressed Whether Muslim or non-Muslim - Prophet Muhammad Ibn Abdullah (PBUH)


Brendar	3rd January 2015 - 12:27 AM Post #38
Posts: 3,190 Group: Elite Member #6 Joined: Nov 20, 2012 Mood None	RawandKurdistani 2nd January 2015 - 08:41 PM Jim Maguire 2nd January 2015 - 04:29 PM Quoting limited to 2 levels deep Come on man, banning alcohol would be a salvation for the world, not a difference between banning alcohol and banning strong narcotics, sure It's tough for some addicts, but they'll get a better life once this poison is out of their lives. And of course I won't stand for murder, what kind of sick world Is It we're living in today? It's as If everything bad Is the norm these days. I do not need to question my position on any of these things, I know I'm right and none can deny that. My friend Jim, what more do you want to know? Rawand please dont turn every topic into a religious debate. Keep your hate towards israel to your self. Lets all stay on topic.



Jim M	3rd January 2015 - 08:08 AM Post #39
R. Sergeant Major Posts: 751 Group: Elite Member #536 Joined: Sep 26, 2014 Mood None	Brendar 3rd January 2015 - 12:27 AM RawandKurdistani 2nd January 2015 - 08:41 PM Quoting limited to 2 levels deep Rawand please dont turn every topic into a religious debate. Keep your hate towards israel to your self. Lets all stay on topic. I agree that this is off topic but it is a very important one as it is about the very principles that this war is being fought. The Islamic State wants to impose its view of morality on the rest of the world in the form of sharia law and coincidentally they are the very things that RawandKurdistani thinks should be imposed on us. On the one side you have the fascists of ISIS that are willing to commit any atrocity on those that don't agree with them and on the other you have the secular state of Kurdistan. The rest of the world seems to agree with the Kurds in saying you can have any kind of extremist view that you want but you can't impose it on anyone else. Maybe this topic is beyond the purview of this forum but it is a very important topic that should be discussed everywhere.
	Kurdish Wisdom of War Proverbs: "Deal with your friends as if they will become your enemies tomorrow, and deal with your enemies as if they will become your friends tomorrow." "Those away from the battlefield boast about their swords." "Those who do not go to war roar like a lion." "Everything is pardoned the brave." "Whoever digs a pit for his enemy should dig it his own size." "A thousand friends are too few; one enemy is one too many."


kurdishpatriot	3rd January 2015 - 08:19 AM Post #40
secular sheikh Posts: 3,161 Group: Elite Member #382 Joined: Mar 16, 2014 Mood None	Jim Maguire 3rd January 2015 - 08:08 AM Brendar 3rd January 2015 - 12:27 AM Quoting limited to 2 levels deep I agree that this is off topic but it is a very important one as it is about the very principles that this war is being fought. The Islamic State wants to impose its view of morality on the rest of the world in the form of sharia law and coincidentally they are the very things that RawandKurdistani thinks should be imposed on us. On the one side you have the fascists of ISIS that are willing to commit any atrocity on those that don't agree with them and on the other you have the secular state of Kurdistan. The rest of the world seems to agree with the Kurds in saying you can have any kind of extremist view that you want but you can't impose it on anyone else. Maybe this topic is beyond the purview of this forum but it is a very important topic that should be discussed everywhere. Yep i have asked him several times to change his signature and even asked alan 2 times. He only has shortened it a bit. Also majorityl of his comments are about islam, quran, banning this and that which are the opposite of freedom, or something else anti west/israel etc... Rawand even says that kurdistan is not secular and is conservative lol. I used to disccus a lot with rawand about these things and discuss about islam but when i do and criticise it with saying it is not a peacefull religion he calls me names like islamophobe, acts childish and keeps spamming islamic quotes or something, or puts a big signature with islamist things and emblems. He even dared to call zagros and islamophobe Edited by kurdishpatriot, 3rd January 2015 - 08:25 AM.
	#PROMOTEWOMENRIGHTS They should be able to decide on their own whether they want to take the pill or want an abortion. "shengal bo ezdi ya", Ezidi namerin, HATA ARAB NAMAYEN NEK SHENGAL! "A society can never be free without women's liberation" - Abdullah Ocalan


RawandKurdistani	3rd January 2015 - 09:58 AM Post #41
Surchi/Xoshnawi Posts: 4,646 Group: Senior Members Member #3 Joined: Nov 17, 2012 Mood None	kurdishpatriot 3rd January 2015 - 08:19 AM Yep i have asked him several times to change his signature and even asked alan 2 times. He only has shortened it a bit. It Is a fascinating coincidence that you want me to change my signature, which Isn't offensive to anyone but hate expressers. This Is a clear violation on basic rights to freedom, whereas my ideas are for an actual cause that Is beyond my own good, but that you frown upon, I do not commit what Is immoral, what good could I ever get from eliminating the deeds among the rest of mankind, will It somehow bring me closer to my lord? No, It won't. It’s for your own sake, not mine. Now let’s get a thing or two straight. Firstly, I would never actually walk into Shengal, the Nineveh Plains, Ankawa etc. with a huge crescent and star on my chest, I understand that would be offensive, purely for the purpose of offending, but I’m not like that. Yes, I may wear a necklace or a similar small item with the crescent and flag or the name of god or whatever, but that would only be noticeable if you looked closely, that wouldn’t be to offend anyone but rather to show who I am without pushing it on people that don’t appreciate it. See I would never mind if you visited my hometown with some Yezidi symbolism on you (even though you’re atheist, don’t believe in Yezidism, and therefore It wouldn’t make sense…), because there’s nothing wrong in peacefully letting the curious eye know about your identity. This is what my signature Is, It tells you who I am as a person, and I feel that Is very important on a forum that Is otherwise filled up with Islamophobic Western Kurds that are nothing less of obsessed with pointing fingers at my religion. My signature doesn’t order anyone to convert, does it? My signature doesn’t tell anyone that their beliefs are wrong, does It (except murderers and addicts)? If anything it’s actually a very peaceful message of believing in god, love for mankind, helping your fellow man regardless of who they are as people, there’s not even anything to suggest that all non-Muslims are dirt or whatever, but one would surely think that’s what It says with this strong opposition coming from you. Quote: “Also majority of his comments are about Islam, Quran” Well have I offended anyone? Show me a single post where I’ve somehow been hostile towards non-Muslims, my messages are always filled up with love and belief in coexistence, oddly enough what you claim I’m ruining, well If coexistence Is to hide your religion (In a country that’s mostly Muslim too just to add it!) and living in the shadow, then that’s not the version of coexistence I will ever support, neither should It be one a self proclaimed liberal as yourself should support. Quote: “banning this and that which are the opposite of freedom, or something else anti west/Israel etc...” Ah freedom, the issue is that you can’t see the difference between righteous freedom and self harm. If you believe there should be freedom, then start with getting rid of your hostile attitude towards Islamic parties for example, that would be a good start, and after that understand that your definition of freedom, same as Jim’s and Brendar’s definition of freedom is anarchy, do you not understand that there’s a reason to why laws are set up these days? Live in an anarchist Kurdistan for a single day or the “free Kurdistan” as you like to call it (as If there are any larger noticeable differences between anarchism and your definition of freedom) and you would be assaulted and brutally killed by extremists, only one of the many scenarios. You talk about your freedom, but you can’t handle your freedom. Limits are made to keep a society in place, not to oppress them and force them into a certain religion, a certain culture or anything like that, but they’re made to avoid what Is harmful, your idea about freedom is romantic (well, on some points...) but It has no place In the real world, It has done nothing more than harm. Secondly, I am not anti West/anti Israel as such, I do not mind populations of these, I do have a problem with the corrupt authorities of some of these countries though, note this does NOT mean I dislike the entire populations of these, for firstly that would be racism, and secondly I actually live in a western country, done so my entire life and I definitely don’t hate this place nor the people, there’s good and bad people among all nations, ESPECIALLY among my own ancestral nation. Quote: “Rawand even says that Kurdistan is not secular and is conservative lol” Well KurdishPatriot, I’m beginning to think you and I have different views about secularism and what It actually Is, I say seculars are a bunch of atheists that really don’t like religion, but they accept it, unlike supporters of state-atheism, and I can tell you Kurdistan Is NOTHING like that, don’t believe me, go visit yourself. This Is how I’ve always seen secularism. According to you however, Secularism is what I would call moderate religiosity, so I really don’t know what to make of this situation here. Quote: “I used to discuss a lot with Rawand about these things and discuss about Islam but when i do and criticize it with saying it is not a peaceful religion he calls me names like Islamophobe” “Calls me names”, lol mate are we not beyond the kindergarten phase? Do you know what the problem with you Is KurdishPatriot? I think that – No, I KNOW that not too deep Inside you really don’t like Islam at all, you love to hear negative views about It, I honestly believe every positive peace loving Islamic quote Is like a stab in your heart. You are offended by peace loving messages in my signature, you are offended by peace loving quotes, you are offended by Islamic symbols, you are offended by Mosques in Kurdistan, at one point In time I told you the same as I’m telling you now, that you dislike Islam, then you actually admitted to dislike my religion, by admitting you find everything Islamic to be In the same category as all IS (those guys you obviously hate as much as I do), once I posted my first positive messages from the Quran, they received an Instant dislike from you within half a minute, If you’re not an Islamophobe, then Richard Dawkins Is Christian. Quote: “ acts childish and keeps spamming Islamic quotes or something” That I have to do, I feel that with all the Islamophobe that has been going on here on KSS through years, I have to still stand up for my religion, and trust me this shizz was far worse before you joined up, as I told you once, I did not exaggerate when I said WW2B would write an entire Islamophobic novel each week. My posts actually lowered this Islamophobia along with racism (and It ended In our dear twisted WW2B leaving the forum) I will stop proving what Islam really Is the day I see all Islamophobia gone, but for a better world, I will never stop promoting the ban of alcohol, abortion and everything else that harms individuals in society. Quote: “ or puts a big signature with Islamist things and emblems.” You see my big signature was actually a response to your signature, In which you promoted Islamophobia, and furthermore also promoted murder (for that I merely put up huge pictures to prove a point, and that point was that I’m well aware of what you’ve written and won’t watch silently) HOWEVER, my edited signature has no purpose to gain attention now, as of now I only try to show who I am as a Muslim Kurd. Quote: “He even dared to call Zagros and Islamophobe haha” Well you know, few welcomed and respected Zagros as well as I did, but if she left because of me, that’s her problem. Now I begin to see that she was always fine with Islamophobic posts, at times she would even like them, however Islamophilia really hurt her feelings, the hypocrisy is ridiculous. Edited by RawandKurdistani, 3rd January 2015 - 10:21 AM.
	I am confused by God's wisdom: In this world of States Why have the Kurds remained Stateless, dispossessed, What for have they all become fugitives, condemned? Ahmad Khani Feed the hungry and visit a sick person And free the captive If he be unjustly confined Assist any person oppressed Whether Muslim or non-Muslim - Prophet Muhammad Ibn Abdullah (PBUH)


kurdishpatriot	3rd January 2015 - 10:29 AM Post #42
secular sheikh Posts: 3,161 Group: Elite Member #382 Joined: Mar 16, 2014 Mood None	RawandKurdistani 3rd January 2015 - 09:58 AM kurdishpatriot 3rd January 2015 - 08:19 AM Yep i have asked him several times to change his signature and even asked alan 2 times. He only has shortened it a bit. It Is a fascinating coincidence that you want me to change my signature, which Isn't offensive to anyone but hate expressers. This Is a clear violation on basic rights to freedom, whereas my ideas are for an actual cause that Is beyond my own good, but that you frown upon, I do not commit what Is immoral, what good could I ever get from eliminating the deeds among the rest of mankind, will It somehow bring me closer to my lord? No, It won't. It’s for your own sake, not mine. Now let’s get a thing or two straight. Firstly, I would never actually walk into Shengal, the Nineveh Plains, Ankawa etc. with a huge crescent and star on my chest, I understand that would be offensive, purely for the purpose of offending, but I’m not like that. Yes, I may wear a necklace or a similar small item with the crescent and flag or the name of god or whatever, but that would only be noticeable if you looked closely, that wouldn’t be to offend anyone but rather to show who I am without pushing it on people that don’t appreciate it. See I would never mind if you visited my hometown with some Yezidi symbolism on you (even though you’re atheist, don’t believe in Yezidism, and therefore It wouldn’t make sense…), because there’s nothing wrong in peacefully letting the curious eye know about your identity. This is what my signature Is, It tells you who I am as a person, and I feel that Is very important on a forum that Is otherwise filled up with Islamophobic Western Kurds that are nothing less of obsessed with pointing fingers at my religion. My signature doesn’t order anyone to convert, does it? My signature doesn’t tell anyone that their beliefs are wrong, does It (except murderers and addicts)? If anything it’s actually a very peaceful message of believing in god, love for mankind, helping your fellow man regardless of who they are as people, there’s not even anything to suggest that all non-Muslims are dirt or whatever, but one would surely think that’s what It says with this strong opposition coming from you. Quote: “Also majority of his comments are about Islam, Quran” Well have I offended anyone? Show me a single post where I’ve somehow been hostile towards non-Muslims, my messages are always filled up with love and belief in coexistence, oddly enough what you claim I’m ruining, well If coexistence Is to hide your religion (In a country that’s mostly Muslim too just to add it!) and living in the shadow, then that’s not the version of coexistence I will ever support, neither should It be one a self proclaimed liberal as yourself should support. Quote: “banning this and that which are the opposite of freedom, or something else anti west/Israel etc...” Ah freedom, the issue is that you can’t see the difference between righteous freedom and self harm. If you believe there should be freedom, then start with getting rid of your hostile attitude towards Islamic parties for example, that would be a good start, and after that understand that your definition of freedom, same as Jim’s and Brendar’s definition of freedom is anarchy, do you not understand that there’s a reason to why laws are set up these days? Live in an anarchist Kurdistan for a single day or the “free Kurdistan” as you like to call it (as If there are any larger noticeable differences between anarchism and your definition of freedom) and you would be assaulted and brutally killed by extremists, only one of the many scenarios. You talk about your freedom, but you can’t handle your freedom. Limits are made to keep a society in place, not to oppress them and force them into a certain religion, a certain culture or anything like that, but they’re made to avoid what Is harmful, your idea about freedom is romantic (well, on some points...) but It has no place In the real world, It has done nothing more than harm. Secondly, I am not anti West/anti Israel as such, I do not mind populations of these, I do have a problem with the corrupt authorities of some of these countries though, note this does NOT mean I dislike the entire populations of these, for firstly that would be racism, and secondly I actually live in a western country, done so my entire life and I definitely don’t hate this place nor the people, there’s good and bad people among all nations, ESPECIALLY among my own ancestral nation. Quote: “Rawand even says that Kurdistan is not secular and is conservative lol” Well KurdishPatriot, I’m beginning to think you and I have different views about secularism and what It actually Is, I say seculars are a bunch of atheists that really don’t like religion, but they accept it, unlike supporters of state-atheism, and I can tell you Kurdistan Is NOTHING like that, don’t believe me, go visit yourself. This Is how I’ve always seen secularism. According to you however, Secularism is what I would call moderate religiosity, so I really don’t know what to make of this situation here. Quote: “I used to discuss a lot with Rawand about these things and discuss about Islam but when i do and criticize it with saying it is not a peaceful religion he calls me names like Islamophobe” “Calls me names”, lol mate are we not beyond the kindergarten phase? Do you know what the problem with you Is KurdishPatriot? I think that – No, I KNOW that not too deep Inside you really don’t like Islam at all, you love to hear negative views about It, I honestly believe every positive peace loving Islamic quote Is like a stab in your heart. You are offended by peace loving messages in my signature, you are offended by peace loving quotes, you are offended by Islamic symbols, you are offended by Mosques in Kurdistan, at one point In time I told you the same as I’m telling you now, that you dislike Islam, then you actually admitted to dislike my religion, by admitting you find everything Islamic to be In the same category as all IS (those guys you obviously hate as much as I do), once I posted my first positive messages from the Quran, they received an Instant dislike from you within half a minute, If you’re not an Islamophobe, then Richard Dawkins Is Christian. Quote: “ acts childish and keeps spamming Islamic quotes or something” That I have to do, I feel that with all the Islamophobe that has been going on here on KSS through years, I have to still stand up for my religion, and trust me this shizz was far worse before you joined up, as I told you once, I did not exaggerate when I said WW2B would write an entire Islamophobic novel each week. My posts actually lowered this Islamophobia along with racism (and It ended In our dear twisted WW2B leaving the forum) I will stop proving what Islam really Is the day I see all Islamophobia gone, but for a better world, I will never stop promoting the ban of alcohol, abortion and everything else that harms individuals in society. Quote: “ or puts a big signature with Islamist things and emblems.” You see my big signature was actually a response to your signature, In which you promoted Islamophobia, and furthermore also promoted murder (for that I merely put up huge pictures to prove a point, and that point was that I’m well aware of what you’ve written and won’t watch silently) HOWEVER, my edited signature has no purpose to gain attention now, as of now I only try to show who I am as a Muslim Kurd. Quote: “He even dared to call Zagros and Islamophobe haha” Well you know, few welcomed and respected Zagros as well as I did, but if she left because of me, that’s her problem. Now I begin to see that she was always fine with Islamophobic posts, at times she would even like them, however Islamophilia really hurt her feelings, the hypocrisy is ridiculous. there are things which are not right in ur comment. With secularism first of all i mean moderate religionism like goran has. I have not much against muslims themself as they dont follow the bad things of quran as beheading the infidels or wage jihad, or cutting hands off. I love that you are posting peacefull quotes but they are all from the religion who is not mine and arrived from arabia.
	#PROMOTEWOMENRIGHTS They should be able to decide on their own whether they want to take the pill or want an abortion. "shengal bo ezdi ya", Ezidi namerin, HATA ARAB NAMAYEN NEK SHENGAL! "A society can never be free without women's liberation" - Abdullah Ocalan


kurdishpatriot	3rd January 2015 - 10:30 AM Post #43
secular sheikh Posts: 3,161 Group: Elite Member #382 Joined: Mar 16, 2014 Mood None	btw i didnt have any signature untill you didnt want to change urs
	#PROMOTEWOMENRIGHTS They should be able to decide on their own whether they want to take the pill or want an abortion. "shengal bo ezdi ya", Ezidi namerin, HATA ARAB NAMAYEN NEK SHENGAL! "A society can never be free without women's liberation" - Abdullah Ocalan


RawandKurdistani	7th January 2015 - 08:02 AM Post #44
Surchi/Xoshnawi Posts: 4,646 Group: Senior Members Member #3 Joined: Nov 17, 2012 Mood None	Quote: there are things which are not right in ur comment. With secularism first of all i mean moderate religionism like goran has. I have not much against muslims themself as they dont follow the bad things of quran as beheading the infidels or wage jihad, or cutting hands off. I love that you are posting peacefull quotes but they are all from the religion who is not mine and arrived from arabia. Here you go, tell me where you find such things to be promoted: http://quran.com/ http://www.christianity-islam.com/holy_quran.html
	I am confused by God's wisdom: In this world of States Why have the Kurds remained Stateless, dispossessed, What for have they all become fugitives, condemned? Ahmad Khani Feed the hungry and visit a sick person And free the captive If he be unjustly confined Assist any person oppressed Whether Muslim or non-Muslim - Prophet Muhammad Ibn Abdullah (PBUH)


ALAN	30th January 2015 - 01:00 AM Post #45
Posts: 34,677 Group: Admins Member #1 Joined: Nov 16, 2012 Mood None	If you want to see all Peshmerga weapons look on SK Peshmerga topic page 1 it's all there I constantly update it...
	Russian Girenak Joseph, who visited Kirkuk in Kurdistan as a part of his tour throu the 1870 - 1873 AD, who published the results of his trip & his studies later in 1879, in the 4th volume in the Bulletin of the Caucasus department of the Royal Geographical Russian Society estimated Kirkuk's population as many as 12-50,000 people, & he emphasized that except 40 Christian families, the rest of the population were Kurds. As for The Turkmen & Arabs, they have not been already existed at the time.


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