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| [ti]SW[/ti]Kurdistan Airforce; Hêzên Asîmanî - Hêzî Hewayî | |
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| Topic Started: 3rd June 2015 - 01:18 AM (86,351 Views) | |
| Adler | 3rd June 2015 - 01:18 AM Post #1 |
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All about the future Kurdish airforce. |
| "The people are sleeping better if they don't know how laws and sausages are made" Bismarck |
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| Adler | 3rd June 2015 - 01:25 AM Post #2 |
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Well, it's a matter of money. Has the KRG money for aircraft and helicopters? |
| "The people are sleeping better if they don't know how laws and sausages are made" Bismarck |
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| Ali Alqosh | 3rd June 2015 - 01:39 AM Post #3 |
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No they don't. It requries quite a lot of money. Not only for buying the aircrafts and missiles, rockets etc but also maintenance. I think we wont see a nurdish airforce for a long time. Maybe attack helis and such but that's it. Although one can always discuss and speculate 
Edited by Ali Alqosh, 3rd June 2015 - 01:40 AM.
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| Adler | 3rd June 2015 - 03:24 AM Post #4 |
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Well, I hope the KRG will make stepts in the direction of independence, soon. But somehow everything seems to develope pretty slow eveywhere. The USA and their futile support for the dead state of Iraq is the main problem here. I hope, it will be possible to donate helicopters to the Kurds, soon. But I've heard nothing about that. |
| "The people are sleeping better if they don't know how laws and sausages are made" Bismarck |
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| FulcrumKAF | 3rd June 2015 - 05:03 AM Post #5 |
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Would you consider Army Aviation as an Air force? I know many people tend to do that for some reason. Kurdistan does already have a de-facto Army Aviation. If you say an established, professional Air Force, I would say by 2025 we would have one (due the current, radical changes I'd say possibly even sooner). We already have a training program in place for pilots in the army, we have air bases (some of which are in active use at the moment, the rest could be made operational for a rather cheap price), KRG have previously looked into buying advanced training aircraft etc. It is moving rather slowly forward, but I think it might speed up due to the recent recognition of KRG by the world and the decrease in Peshmerga numbers (thus speeding up the modernization process).
Edited by FulcrumKAF, 3rd June 2015 - 05:07 AM.
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| The army is the true nobility of a nation Never plan on the thoughts of others, but on their capabilities One indivisible and sovereign Kurdish nation for all Kurds! Chase all al nusra and Daash terrorists out of Kurdistan!! Her biji YPG u Peshmerga! |
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| Jim M | 3rd June 2015 - 05:08 AM Post #6 |
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The MD530F is the identical aircraft that the KRG acquired last year. These aircraft can be easily converted to helicopter gunship mode with off the shelf components. The KRG has 12 of these for traffic control.!!! Afghan Air Force's Newest Weapon Against Terrorists: MD-530F Close Air Attack Helicopter 
Edited by Jim M, 6th June 2015 - 09:32 AM.
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Kurdish Wisdom of War Proverbs: "Deal with your friends as if they will become your enemies tomorrow, and deal with your enemies as if they will become your friends tomorrow." "Those away from the battlefield boast about their swords." "Those who do not go to war roar like a lion." "Everything is pardoned the brave." "Whoever digs a pit for his enemy should dig it his own size." "A thousand friends are too few; one enemy is one too many." |
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| Jim M | 3rd June 2015 - 05:54 AM Post #7 |
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Extended Range Weapons Wing (ER2W) This "wing" can be attached easily in a few hours and every helicopter the KRG has can be turned into a gunship just as easily. http://maceaviation.com/case-study/industry-shaking-innovation/ |
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Kurdish Wisdom of War Proverbs: "Deal with your friends as if they will become your enemies tomorrow, and deal with your enemies as if they will become your friends tomorrow." "Those away from the battlefield boast about their swords." "Those who do not go to war roar like a lion." "Everything is pardoned the brave." "Whoever digs a pit for his enemy should dig it his own size." "A thousand friends are too few; one enemy is one too many." |
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| Jim M | 3rd June 2015 - 02:41 PM Post #8 |
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If you check the pictures on this forum you will find the KRG has quite a few helicopters. All of which can be converted to helicopter gunships. I don't know about anyone else but it would make me very uneasy living in a country that's at war where the government thinks traffic control is more important than fighting for your life.
Edited by Jim M, 7th June 2015 - 03:44 PM.
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Kurdish Wisdom of War Proverbs: "Deal with your friends as if they will become your enemies tomorrow, and deal with your enemies as if they will become your friends tomorrow." "Those away from the battlefield boast about their swords." "Those who do not go to war roar like a lion." "Everything is pardoned the brave." "Whoever digs a pit for his enemy should dig it his own size." "A thousand friends are too few; one enemy is one too many." |
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| Jim M | 7th June 2015 - 03:45 PM Post #9 |
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Just a thought but no matter what these aircraft are used for now there are men fighting and dying for want of close air support. MD-530F helicopters delivered last year to the KRG .  Even these can be converted with twin 7.62 LMG's (light machine guns) in the front cockpit.
Edited by Jim M, 8th June 2015 - 09:49 AM.
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Kurdish Wisdom of War Proverbs: "Deal with your friends as if they will become your enemies tomorrow, and deal with your enemies as if they will become your friends tomorrow." "Those away from the battlefield boast about their swords." "Those who do not go to war roar like a lion." "Everything is pardoned the brave." "Whoever digs a pit for his enemy should dig it his own size." "A thousand friends are too few; one enemy is one too many." |
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| Worldwar2boy | 7th June 2015 - 05:31 PM Post #10 |
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Not going to happen. These helicopters are not made for warfare. The support they are able to provide will be minimal and Daesh has the weapons to EASILY shoot these helicopters down (these are not choppers that can provide accurate fire from a high altitude, they have to fly lower than combat choppers, which makes them even easier to shoot down). KRG can't afford to; - Waste pilots - Waste resources - Provide Daesh with an easy (propaganda) victory They receive air support from the world's largest air force. That's enough for now.
Edited by Worldwar2boy, 7th June 2015 - 05:31 PM.
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| biji kurd u kurdistan !! | |
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| Jim M | 8th June 2015 - 03:21 AM Post #11 |
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The MD530F's of the KRG are identical to the one ones in Afghanistan (check it out) and the KRG has oil which Afghanistan doesn't so they should be able to afford them. The KRG even has helicopter pilots that have been trained but aren't doing anything right now. If you put guns on those KRG helicopters I guarantee you there will be no shortage of volunteers to fly them to kill Daesh. The US does not supply CAP (close air support) and worse they do not even provide FAC (forward air control) and as far as I know when you are fighting a war you throw in everything you've got so you can win. It looks like the KRG has one hand tied behind its back but it hasn't been tied by anyone but themselves. Worst of all what kind of lame excuses are these when people are dying on the front lines for lack of close air support. What is most interesting about Afghanistan and the insurgency that is happening there and the similarity of what is happening with the conflict the KRG is engaged in. The conclusion you are making is that the weapons the Afghan air force is using are not suitable for the KRG against a similar enemy? (Downloadable PDF on the future of Close Air Support in 2015)
Edited by Jim M, 23rd June 2015 - 10:49 AM.
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Kurdish Wisdom of War Proverbs: "Deal with your friends as if they will become your enemies tomorrow, and deal with your enemies as if they will become your friends tomorrow." "Those away from the battlefield boast about their swords." "Those who do not go to war roar like a lion." "Everything is pardoned the brave." "Whoever digs a pit for his enemy should dig it his own size." "A thousand friends are too few; one enemy is one too many." |
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| Halo | 8th June 2015 - 03:27 AM Post #12 |
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what an ker lol daesh propaganda
Edited by Halo, 8th June 2015 - 03:28 AM.
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| Jim M | 8th June 2015 - 04:01 AM Post #13 |
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Close Air Support (CAP) solutions: SIAI-Marchetti SF-260M Another airplane that could be used for close air support (CAP) is the excellent little SIAI-Marchetti SF-260M that has been very successful as a trainer and light attack aircraft for small airforces. These aircraft are the most successful aircraft in its category and are plentiful enough that the KRG could acquire a constant supply. These aircraft are fully aerobatic which is the reason civilian pilots love them. Depending on condition they can be serviced and reconfigured easily back to military status, armed and sent into combat in a very short time. They are fully supported by the factory and even the older models with piston engines can be upgraded to turbo-prop with a big boost in performance. They can be purchased used on the civilian market in military configuration and then armed ready to fight for about $250K US. The great thing about these aircraft is they can be used as trainers when larger more powerful aircraft come on line. This would be an almost instant solution to the current lack of close air support. 
Edited by Jim M, 23rd June 2015 - 10:54 AM.
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Kurdish Wisdom of War Proverbs: "Deal with your friends as if they will become your enemies tomorrow, and deal with your enemies as if they will become your friends tomorrow." "Those away from the battlefield boast about their swords." "Those who do not go to war roar like a lion." "Everything is pardoned the brave." "Whoever digs a pit for his enemy should dig it his own size." "A thousand friends are too few; one enemy is one too many." |
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| Jim M | 8th June 2015 - 06:01 AM Post #14 |
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USAF begins Afghan A-29 Super Tucano training The US Air Force (USAF) has begun training Afghan pilots and maintainers on the Embraer A-29 Super Tucano light attack aircraft at Moody Air Force Base (AFB) in Georgia, the service announced on 8 January. The Super Tucano features a single 1,600 SHP Pratt & Whitney PT6A-68/3 turboprop engine and can carry an array of weapons. The aircraft carries two 12.7 mm machine guns (200 rounds each) in the wings, and can be configured with additional underwing weaponry such as 20 mm cannon pods, additional 12.7 mm machine guns, rockets pods, precision-guided munitions, and/or 'dumb' bombs up to 1,500 kg. It has a seven-hour endurance, and can operate from semi-prepared air fields. (This aircraft is much more capable than its closest competitor the Beechcraft AT-6 and most important it has a proven record compared to the AT-6 Texan II.) With the programme now seemingly back on track, USAF and AAF officials will be hoping that there are no more interruptions and delays in rolling out this much-needed light attack capability. http://www.janes.com/article/47801/usaf-begins-afghan-super-tucano-training Unfortunately Tucano's are expensive at $10-14 million apiece depending on how many you buy.  (If I was in the KRG I would ask the Israeli's to order these for me just to circumvent the objections of Baghdad. This may not be required anyway as the country that manufactures these is Brazil and not a signatory of NATO.) 
Edited by Jim M, 8th June 2015 - 10:59 AM.
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Kurdish Wisdom of War Proverbs: "Deal with your friends as if they will become your enemies tomorrow, and deal with your enemies as if they will become your friends tomorrow." "Those away from the battlefield boast about their swords." "Those who do not go to war roar like a lion." "Everything is pardoned the brave." "Whoever digs a pit for his enemy should dig it his own size." "A thousand friends are too few; one enemy is one too many." |
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| Jim M | 8th June 2015 - 09:31 AM Post #15 |
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Pilatus PC-7 Mark II Turbo Trainer/attack ac An alternative to the Super Tucano might be the Pilatus PC-7 Turbo Trainer/attack ac at about half the price of the Super Tucano. It has an almost identical airframe to the AT-6 Texan II but in this case it has a proven record as an attack aircraft. Performance wise it is no where near the Super Tucano (or the Texan II) but the price in this case might make it more interesting. Switzerland is not a signatory to NATO either but it may be just as problematic buying them from the factory. There are however civilian versions of this a/c that can be converted and again Israel might help here. 
Edited by Jim M, 8th June 2015 - 01:08 PM.
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Kurdish Wisdom of War Proverbs: "Deal with your friends as if they will become your enemies tomorrow, and deal with your enemies as if they will become your friends tomorrow." "Those away from the battlefield boast about their swords." "Those who do not go to war roar like a lion." "Everything is pardoned the brave." "Whoever digs a pit for his enemy should dig it his own size." "A thousand friends are too few; one enemy is one too many." |
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| Jim M | 8th June 2015 - 10:24 AM Post #16 |
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The ultimate: The Northrop F5 (Its amazing to me that civilians in the US can own this a/c but the KRG can't.) My ultimate solution to the KRG's lack of an air force though is the F5 Tiger II. Enough of these aircraft would put it on an equal footing with its biggest enemies. This aircraft still flies today with the "Top Gun" school of the US military so its performance is still relevant. Amazingly Northrop still provides full factory support but the most important fact about this aircraft is it can be put in the air for 1/5 the cost of an F16. Many of these aircraft are available from air forces that are phasing this aircraft out of their inventories and would have to be completely rebuilt. But fortunately Israel's Elbit Systems leads the world in F5 upgrades and the end product would be the equal of anything the KRG's worst antagonists can put in the field. With the ferry tanks shown on this Chilean F5E they can be flown from anywhere in the world to the KRG.  Chilean F5E Tiger III upgraded by Elbit Systems Israel
Edited by Jim M, 6th October 2015 - 07:18 AM.
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Kurdish Wisdom of War Proverbs: "Deal with your friends as if they will become your enemies tomorrow, and deal with your enemies as if they will become your friends tomorrow." "Those away from the battlefield boast about their swords." "Those who do not go to war roar like a lion." "Everything is pardoned the brave." "Whoever digs a pit for his enemy should dig it his own size." "A thousand friends are too few; one enemy is one too many." |
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| ALAN | 9th June 2015 - 08:44 PM Post #17 |
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We can't even get weapons like M198 let alone jets 
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| Russian Girenak Joseph, who visited Kirkuk in Kurdistan as a part of his tour throu the 1870 - 1873 AD, who published the results of his trip & his studies later in 1879, in the 4th volume in the Bulletin of the Caucasus department of the Royal Geographical Russian Society estimated Kirkuk's population as many as 12-50,000 people, & he emphasized that except 40 Christian families, the rest of the population were Kurds. As for The Turkmen & Arabs, they have not been already existed at the time. | |
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| ALAN | 9th June 2015 - 09:00 PM Post #18 |
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| Russian Girenak Joseph, who visited Kirkuk in Kurdistan as a part of his tour throu the 1870 - 1873 AD, who published the results of his trip & his studies later in 1879, in the 4th volume in the Bulletin of the Caucasus department of the Royal Geographical Russian Society estimated Kirkuk's population as many as 12-50,000 people, & he emphasized that except 40 Christian families, the rest of the population were Kurds. As for The Turkmen & Arabs, they have not been already existed at the time. | |
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| ALAN | 9th June 2015 - 09:06 PM Post #19 |
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| Russian Girenak Joseph, who visited Kirkuk in Kurdistan as a part of his tour throu the 1870 - 1873 AD, who published the results of his trip & his studies later in 1879, in the 4th volume in the Bulletin of the Caucasus department of the Royal Geographical Russian Society estimated Kirkuk's population as many as 12-50,000 people, & he emphasized that except 40 Christian families, the rest of the population were Kurds. As for The Turkmen & Arabs, they have not been already existed at the time. | |
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| ALAN | 9th June 2015 - 09:14 PM Post #20 |
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| Russian Girenak Joseph, who visited Kirkuk in Kurdistan as a part of his tour throu the 1870 - 1873 AD, who published the results of his trip & his studies later in 1879, in the 4th volume in the Bulletin of the Caucasus department of the Royal Geographical Russian Society estimated Kirkuk's population as many as 12-50,000 people, & he emphasized that except 40 Christian families, the rest of the population were Kurds. As for The Turkmen & Arabs, they have not been already existed at the time. | |
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| ALAN | 9th June 2015 - 09:16 PM Post #21 |
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KRG has borrowed 4x Chinooks from Italy I hope they buy them off in the future
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| Russian Girenak Joseph, who visited Kirkuk in Kurdistan as a part of his tour throu the 1870 - 1873 AD, who published the results of his trip & his studies later in 1879, in the 4th volume in the Bulletin of the Caucasus department of the Royal Geographical Russian Society estimated Kirkuk's population as many as 12-50,000 people, & he emphasized that except 40 Christian families, the rest of the population were Kurds. As for The Turkmen & Arabs, they have not been already existed at the time. | |
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| FulcrumKAF | 10th June 2015 - 12:52 AM Post #22 |
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Po210
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Kurdish made STOL CH 701 (5 built so far);     
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| The army is the true nobility of a nation Never plan on the thoughts of others, but on their capabilities One indivisible and sovereign Kurdish nation for all Kurds! Chase all al nusra and Daash terrorists out of Kurdistan!! Her biji YPG u Peshmerga! |
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| Jim M | 10th June 2015 - 05:59 AM Post #23 |
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This is a company in the US that sells F5's to civilians. I guarantee I could get one of these to the KRG if they hired me. If one of these turned up in the KRG with a Kurdistan flag painted on it that would be the end of the embargo. Military Jet Sales - Thornton Aircraft Company TAC  They have two T38 trainers and one F5A for sale right now. http://www.thorntonaircraft.com/body/body.cfm?page_name=mil |
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Kurdish Wisdom of War Proverbs: "Deal with your friends as if they will become your enemies tomorrow, and deal with your enemies as if they will become your friends tomorrow." "Those away from the battlefield boast about their swords." "Those who do not go to war roar like a lion." "Everything is pardoned the brave." "Whoever digs a pit for his enemy should dig it his own size." "A thousand friends are too few; one enemy is one too many." |
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| ALAN | 10th June 2015 - 10:05 PM Post #24 |
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 there is KRG rep in Washington have you thought of contacting them? The new person in charge is Bayan a lady. |
| Russian Girenak Joseph, who visited Kirkuk in Kurdistan as a part of his tour throu the 1870 - 1873 AD, who published the results of his trip & his studies later in 1879, in the 4th volume in the Bulletin of the Caucasus department of the Royal Geographical Russian Society estimated Kirkuk's population as many as 12-50,000 people, & he emphasized that except 40 Christian families, the rest of the population were Kurds. As for The Turkmen & Arabs, they have not been already existed at the time. | |
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| FulcrumKAF | 10th June 2015 - 11:13 PM Post #25 |
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I just noticed I had included a picture of the Ikarus C42 in my previous post by mistake. It is neither a STOL CH701 nor Kurdish made. Kurdistan bought the Ikarus C42s for the pilot training program, and they are currently stationed in Arbat airbase. I will visit them soon, so I will hopefully get some new updates on the situation there.   |
| The army is the true nobility of a nation Never plan on the thoughts of others, but on their capabilities One indivisible and sovereign Kurdish nation for all Kurds! Chase all al nusra and Daash terrorists out of Kurdistan!! Her biji YPG u Peshmerga! |
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